In June 2021, a physician testifying before the Ohio state legislature claimed that COVID vaccines made people magnetic. Then a registered nurse from Strongsville tried to prove it.
I am so thankful for vaccines. I had a very bad case of COVID prior to availability of vaccines. Nothing ever made me so sick as COVID. As an RN seeing all the death and disabilities due to COVID and the fear of a vaccine rather than the pathogen 🦠 is concerning. The widespread use of misinformation concerning heath is dangerous.
That must have been scary. However, I have had Covid 3 times and it’s never been more than a mild cold for me. Of course I find the vaccine more scary, given it has a risk of death and disability attached to it, and would appear to lack any discernible benefit. What I think is dangerous is lax regulatory standards and a captured advisory body.
That would be nice but there isn’t immunity which is why everyone is getting reinfected multiple times. Covid doesn’t operate like that and 1 infection wrecks your immunity
Covid immunity doesn't last long, and is not cross protective against newer variants. Laugh if you will, but why do you think so many people have had covid several times?
Your first response was to Sophocles, who stated he had it 3 times....so much for wonderful natural immunity!
It’s vaccinated people who continue getting covid because their immune systems clear the infection due to IGg4 antibodies that treat the infection like an allergen. Everyone I know who has been vaccinated and boosted is sick all the time now. My husband and I were not, we each had covid over two years ago and have not had it since. We take care of our immune systems with vitamins D, C, zinc and real food. We don’t hide from covid.
You are wrong of course. Repeated vaccination may cause an IgG4 shift which "might" induce a degree of tolerance to Covid, but which does not increase the risk of infection.
I'm afraid that natural immunity doesn't provide any durable protection, as any simple internet search will tell you.
I never fail to be amazed that people can fall for the quackery of "experts" who create the most outrageous arguments to fight science and medicine. Thanks, Dr Offitt, for calling some of them out.
And it is scary that this person also is an MD. Early on a group of docs, which called themselves, Americas Frontline Doctors, pushed hydroxychloroquine even after studies showed it was ineffective. One of the MDs had a web page that claimed that there was alien DNA in our medicines and that sexual issues were caused by having sex with demons. Really.
I live 45 minutes away from Sandy Hook and the fact that she is trying to pin the worst day in our state's history on vaccines just infuriates me to no end. Those children (including the shooter) didn't die because they were vaccinated. They died because of a very disturbed young person whose mother, who obviously had her own set of problems, thought purchasing destructive guns would help him. CT has some of the strongest gun laws in the nation after this horrible day when those beautiful children and adults who tried to save them were taken from us.
As an added note, I tested positive on Christmas day (up-to-date on vaccines and boosted) as COVID finally caught up with me, in my late 60's, ended last week of 2023 battling COVID to enter the first week of 2024 with a cold virus on top of it. Very unpleasant but it never got into my lungs. So YAY for vaccines!!!!
Interesting that a lot of her assertions - DNA damage, higher risk of dementia and infertility, and geriatric-cidal if not genocidal effects - have been proven for Covid illness.
Mitochondrial DNA damage in particular occurs with illness. Via our local CHOP :
You know what? At this point I don’t even think these people’s issues are vaccines themselves. They just want a social scapegoat to blame their social, political and economical issues on. Before it used to be the Jews, then the Muslims and now the vaccine. Vaccines are an excuse, even for many antivaxxers. It’s simply a weapon to give meaning to some people’s lives and
some conservative political appointees something to yap about as it fits their anti-establishment and anti-government philosophy of life. I think our focus should be on the vaccine hesitant. Those neutral everyday people/patients who don’t bother to think twice when they hear such blatant and fear based messaging from influencers or even MD and scientifically trained professionals. They simply focus on the fear and risk they hear. It’s thus the job of health care professionals to establish this trust with their patients and take the time to explain things to them - at least the ones who are open to discussion! Thank you Dr. Offit.
Dr Offit, why present ridiculous examples? Everyone would be better served if you joined forces with those the vaccines skeptics side agree are the best representing the opposing views and had public discussions to get to the bottom of key issues facing the vaccine efforts. Continuing a smear campaign (anti-vaxx) is losing support for you. From say Jan 2020 to now, just for myself I’ve done a complete 180 on what you have to say on things. I’m just being honest with you, these tactics are only causing you to lose support and credibility. It’s time for you to take a new approach to gaining back support. Or do you continue to refuse an different approach such as what I describe above because subjected to that format the whole vaccine scheme falls apart? The vaccine side seems to acknowledge all products come with a risk, but for whatever reason they also seem to act in a manner that the public can’t know about these risks at any cost.
Presumably before you were provax, and are now antivax. Hopefully not for all vaccines, that would be both sad and ridiculous.
I can see how people can be persuaded that the covid vaccines are harmful, and how put off they were by “mandates” (though nobody was ever forced to get vaccinated, there was always the option to just say “no thanks”), but let’s put aside all the ideology and toxicity that politics has helped create, and just look at the plain facts of “Have these vaccines caused more benefit than harm?”
Of that there can be no doubt that the proven benefits greatly exceeds the proven harms.
The correct position to take would be to remain cautiously provaccine in your case at this point in time, so no “180” is necessary, maybe a “30” or so?
Yes was on board at the start. The covid experience was so bad, there are so many examples of where pharma / regulators purposely misled the population. Right at the start, the extensive denial of the involvement with the wuhan lab as an example. Once you see the industry is this corrupt, they have lost credibility.
I feel they have fallen from such a high pedestal that they can no longer simply dismiss their critics, that tactic is finished. To gain back respect and trust will require sitting down for open transparent discussions with those that have grievances with the actions and positions they have taken throughout this public health disaster - they were the leaders they must accept responsibility for the failures, continuing to point the finger and blame critics for their shortcomings is further eroding their credibility.
At this point refusing to engage is simply furthering the mistrust. I said before, if society is truly at risk from declining interest in vaccines then public health have a responsibility to address these issues head on. Quite frankly the opposing voices have continued to be vindicated throughout the last 4 years, their track record calling where things were going has been much better. There are so many major points public health had it totally wrong. It’s time they come to the table.
Steve, the “popular” press is owned by the same institutional investors that own Pfizer, Moderna, etc. It was a different world in the 1970’s when Mike Wallace on CBS’s 60 Minutes exposed the pharma fraud with the 1976 swine flu. You won’t see that sort of programming from the legacy media any longer.
And by comparison the level of fraud in 1976 was nothing compared to this time around. What was it something like 50 correlates deaths with 40 million shots and the whole program was paused then cancelled. Even Pfizer identified over a 1000 deaths they were aware of in their 90 day reporting and the regulators said no there is zero signal of problems.
The industry is a fraud, and full of people that will not stand up to say something is wrong. Just look at the emails between Collins and Fauci Jan-Feb 2020, these guys know they were up to no good.
You’re opening this up to everything relating to Covid, not just the vaccine science or Covid science, but to public health, politics and ideology.
For each science “fact” that has proved contentious or controversial, there are countless “facts” that are uncontested. The problem is you don’t hear about them, but each one that is wrong is trumpeted from the rooftops and widely spread all over social and MS media as “proof” all the science was wrong.
This is clearly a biased way of looking at things.
Mike I grew up in a household with a dentist and RN for parents. At that time medical people were among the most respected and trusted people within the communities they served - whether it was warranted is a further discussion.
They both graduated into their professions in the early 50’s. It was a much different environment back then, most doctors worked for themselves, they were autonomous to express their medical opinions, they had to answer for their positions and actions, they were not subservient to corporations, etc. There was limited advertising, you hung out your shingle and listed in the white pages, it was even considered in bad taste to advertise in the yellow pages. The age of persuasion of what we see now would be disgusting to this old guard that are long gone. The regulators were not funded by the very companies they were supposed to be monitoring and keeping to account on behalf of society. That has all changed, the conflicts of interests are overwhelming and anyone that doesn’t recognize them is either naive or part of the system benefiting from it.
Things like the CDC refusing to share the V-Safe data collected specific for the covid shots and only did so after being drawn through legal proceedings to enforce FOIA provisions. That does not inspire confidence in a system that is charged with the responsibility to look out for the public’s best interest. And the fact that the CDC’s reports produced from the v-safe data to show effectiveness and safety only following participants mostly for 1 week following vaccination should be viewed as fraudulent.
Healthcare is totally captured by the pharmaceutical industry and the vast majority of the regulators and practitioners are complicit in going along with the interests of the pharma companies. Under this environment the percentage of the population on daily drug prescriptions and taking an ever increasing number of vaccines tracks right along with ever increasing rates of chronic diseases in adults and children. We are on an insane path, we keep getting sicker yet we keep taking more of what’s not working.
It’s time people take a big step back and reevaluate, but that’s going to be very tough, because pharma will go down with the ship fighting such a direction. What’s in our best interest does not align with what is in pharma’s interest. But even in such a lopsided struggle where pharma has essentially unlimited resources and has captured regulators, practitioners, politicians, media, etc a small group is getting traction bringing light to these issues - mind you it’s always easier when you are in the side of reality.
So this is why I say public health must face their skeptics in a public forum.
1. What happens in the US is vastly different to what happens elsewhere. In the UK for example, with its socialised medicine model, we don't see the conflicts of financial interest that you refer to. Yet the scientific facts around covid know no geographical boundaries, and funnily enough they seem to be the same in other countries.
2. Regarding V-safe, the data was "analysed" and published by a conflicted [antivaccine] source [ICAN] in a way to make vaccines appear to be very harmful, but this was a snake and mirrors excercise in its entirety.
For example, it was implied that a report indicated that the vaccine was the CAUSE of the problem, but this was not so and the V-safe respondents logged all medical problems they had experienced over the course of a year following their first vaccine shot. Events reported could be entirely coincidental, such as a broken arm or arthritis starting 7 months after getting the vaccine. There was horror expressed at how 7.7% of those reporting any events following vaccination had to seek medical advice...but what they don't say is that over the course of the year this amounts to just 0.08 visits per person on average per year...right?
Yet what they also don't tell you is that the average American seeks some form of medical advice 4 times per year on average. So getting vaccinated appears to hugely reduce illness and the need for seeking medical advice...correct?
Thanks for your thoughtful reply, I believe in the right settling we could have a constructive, interesting visit. I wanted to reply promptly but have to run currently, your comments have me thinking some further thoughts I’d like to share. This texting format can be dangerous in that thoughts can be interpreted not as intended - particularly on the matter of offending people. Keep in mind 4 years ago I would have been right in line with you, and I’m not alone in that department.
Hi Mike, I feel the American / Fauci response to key points set the tone that the world followed: lock down protocols, testing, natural origins, inappropriate and lack of early treatment, natural immunity not being a thing, etc. If there was ever a time that cancelling the RCT should not have been allowed this was it, forever the throw back will be correlation doesn’t confirm causation - this is one of Fauci’s oldest manipulations / fraud.
Socialized medicine is just as likely to interfere in the patient / doctor relationship as the current American system. In both models the doctor is not working for the patient. In the American one the doctor answers to the corporations and insurance companies. In the socialist model the doctor answers to the state. We saw in covid doctors weren’t free to develop and deploy treatments as arrived at between themselves and their patient. As in all relationships the one that pays calls the shots - just ask a stay at home mom that doesn’t leave a drunk that beats her. A doctor only works for you when you reach into your pocket and pay them.
Regarding ICAN, they are a thorn in the side of anyone advocating for vaccines. I think in a world free of discrimination for personal health choices (ie a world without vaccine mandates) something like ICAN may not exist. All they are saying is that vaccines should be subject to true informed consent and freedom to decided. I don’t believe ICAN has ever done anything to deny people from being able to decide to vaccinate, they just don’t want to be forced to take them. The whole social contract argument falls apart when the vaccinated are catching and spreading disease. And it’s not just the covid shots that do not sterilize disease, it’s the same for most of them. The vaccine side would have everyone believe a world without MMR would lead to mortality rates that existed in the 1800’s. that’s just misleading the CDC’s records show morality rates / 1000 declined drastically before the era of vaccinations.
And why the reluctance to do vaxxd verse unvaxxed comparisons, the CDC have the data. The odd occasion they have happened pharma goes into damage control. The DTP African study by Abby and Benn where they were surprised by the results where protection against the specific disease vaccinated for was positive but all cause mortality among the vaccinated was a 5x the unvaccinated.
Overall public health is getting worse, it’s accepted that chronic disease rates are getting worse. Many of the problems are autoimmune based. There could be multiple factors contributing to this: food, lifestyle, etc, but the one item that directly interacts in this domain by stimulating immune responses (vaccines) is forbidden from being part of the conversation. This despite pharma making moves in the early 80’s to exit the vaccine space unless the Gov’t took over liability. Then once liability was resolved has significantly increased the number of doses that are mandated to take. There is just so many problem with the vaccine space. Believe me I would not entertain the idea 5 years ago, but not because I looked into it, but because as I explained from my upbringing I was in a position in which I was primed to believe anything doctors / health professionals recommended. I didn’t get educated by organizations like children’s health defence or ICAN I wasn’t aware of them at all, I learned the hard way although I am aware of them now.
I’ve also learned that many people with a careers worth of giving vaccines are just like I was, it would never occur to them to question anything. As an example if you share the clinical trial parameters of the hep B shot they flat out won’t believe it: the lack of participants, short duration, etc. anyway, there are lots of problem as I said before and the challenging part for the vaccine advocates is that the real world situation of ever worsening health and chronic disease is a disconnect with taking ever more shots that are to be believed to make you invincible for each one that you check off. The fact that we are taking so many more shots now compared to 30+ years ago we should be so much healthier overall but we’re not.
Skepticism is a growing fact, if there is a sliver lining to covid it’s that it has got people asking a lot of questions. And the response of industry to attack the questions rather than go totally transparent to address the crisis says a lot - I believe them less all the time. The number of people not trusting public health is growing. Pharma / public health have not had to to deal with justifying themselves (they were successful simply dismissing questions in the past) and as a result have no experience in this position and the tactic they are taking are making their situation worse.
I think the main thing is I’m very happy for someone to get as many boosters as they wish, that’s none of my concern. Drop the mandates and the issue largely goes away. The whole no one is safe until everyone is safe is simply propaganda. Covid highlighted this very clearly. To those that can’t be bothered to dig deep to look, and rely on the media that is owned by pharma to tell them what to think, the idea that pharma is corrupt is just crazy.
Sorry for the long response, hopefully I didn’t lose your interest, I understand if I did. Over a beer it would be much better I’m sure.
Is there any evidence that a concern about “magnetism” played any significant role in vaccine hesitancy in the USA? Does it explain why millions of Americans got the first mRNA dose but not the second? To make any progress on this problem, we have to address the real issues: the covid authoritarianism that destroyed trust in the public health apparatus, failure to address legitimate safety concerns, the illegal OSHA mandate, careless approval/recommendation of boosters, and the shifting amorphous “Science” that was used to justify it all. Bogus straw man arguments like these are simply being used to justify censorship of all legitimate questioning of vaccination.
It played a role in anti-vax sentiment for at least two people and presumably more....And it puts a lot of skepticsm on her other claims about the vaccines
There was a NYT article in 2021 that featured several people who got severe covid, had not received the vax because they falsely believed that “masks” and distancing would protect them. There was lots of misinformation of all kinds. Perseverating on magnetism and chips is a road to nowhere.
Masks and distancing were better than nothing and did help. Other respiratory infectious diseases plummeted (see link below). But vaccines are still the best.
Focus on magnetism and chips is also a thinly veiled attempt to cast all of the unvaxxed as a subhuman class of morons It belies an arrogance and elitism that guarantees that this problem will get worse.
Lucid and terse. Sinclair Lewis character George Babbitt would have loved your article because it has “punch” and “sizzle” and “pow”. Many thanks for the exegesis of glaring stupidity regarding claims of “the magnetic side effects" of receiving mRNA vaccine products. And the testimony of this apparently licensed doctor to the Ohio solons was presumably under oath.
I am so thankful for vaccines. I had a very bad case of COVID prior to availability of vaccines. Nothing ever made me so sick as COVID. As an RN seeing all the death and disabilities due to COVID and the fear of a vaccine rather than the pathogen 🦠 is concerning. The widespread use of misinformation concerning heath is dangerous.
That must have been scary. However, I have had Covid 3 times and it’s never been more than a mild cold for me. Of course I find the vaccine more scary, given it has a risk of death and disability attached to it, and would appear to lack any discernible benefit. What I think is dangerous is lax regulatory standards and a captured advisory body.
Yes, ….of course you’d find the vaccine more scary, because you’ve swallowed a load of antivaccine propaganda.
If you had covid, you have natural immunity, better than anything a vaccine can provide.
That would be nice but there isn’t immunity which is why everyone is getting reinfected multiple times. Covid doesn’t operate like that and 1 infection wrecks your immunity
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂🤣🤣😂🤣🤣🤔🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😄😄😄😄😁😁😁🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻
Just WoW! I didn’t think there was anyone who believed this crap.
Covid immunity doesn't last long, and is not cross protective against newer variants. Laugh if you will, but why do you think so many people have had covid several times?
Your first response was to Sophocles, who stated he had it 3 times....so much for wonderful natural immunity!
It’s vaccinated people who continue getting covid because their immune systems clear the infection due to IGg4 antibodies that treat the infection like an allergen. Everyone I know who has been vaccinated and boosted is sick all the time now. My husband and I were not, we each had covid over two years ago and have not had it since. We take care of our immune systems with vitamins D, C, zinc and real food. We don’t hide from covid.
You are wrong of course. Repeated vaccination may cause an IgG4 shift which "might" induce a degree of tolerance to Covid, but which does not increase the risk of infection.
I'm afraid that natural immunity doesn't provide any durable protection, as any simple internet search will tell you.
Why haven’t the people making these claims produced a physiological mechanism by which these alleged phenomena can occur?
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence beyond anecdotes.
See my post further down. There are possibilities.
I never fail to be amazed that people can fall for the quackery of "experts" who create the most outrageous arguments to fight science and medicine. Thanks, Dr Offitt, for calling some of them out.
And it is scary that this person also is an MD. Early on a group of docs, which called themselves, Americas Frontline Doctors, pushed hydroxychloroquine even after studies showed it was ineffective. One of the MDs had a web page that claimed that there was alien DNA in our medicines and that sexual issues were caused by having sex with demons. Really.
A recent study showed that ~17,000 death,it was not only ineffective but deadly. Funny we don't hear about that...
citation please
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S075333222301853X
Dont click link steve . KB LINK is fake. Search sciencedirect.com. use vovid 19 vaccine death and you will not find a paper KB mentions
It’s a paper about 17,000 deaths from hydrxychloroquine
You're right, I typed in ovid-19 vaccine death and find no paper. I typed in hydroxychloroquine death and found the paper!
I live 45 minutes away from Sandy Hook and the fact that she is trying to pin the worst day in our state's history on vaccines just infuriates me to no end. Those children (including the shooter) didn't die because they were vaccinated. They died because of a very disturbed young person whose mother, who obviously had her own set of problems, thought purchasing destructive guns would help him. CT has some of the strongest gun laws in the nation after this horrible day when those beautiful children and adults who tried to save them were taken from us.
As an added note, I tested positive on Christmas day (up-to-date on vaccines and boosted) as COVID finally caught up with me, in my late 60's, ended last week of 2023 battling COVID to enter the first week of 2024 with a cold virus on top of it. Very unpleasant but it never got into my lungs. So YAY for vaccines!!!!
Interesting that a lot of her assertions - DNA damage, higher risk of dementia and infertility, and geriatric-cidal if not genocidal effects - have been proven for Covid illness.
Mitochondrial DNA damage in particular occurs with illness. Via our local CHOP :
https://www.chop.edu/news/researchers-find-covid-19-causes-mitochondrial-dysfunction-heart-and-other-organs#:~:text=Now%2C%20a%20multi%2Dinstitutional%20consortium,virus%2C%20leading%20to%20dysfunction%20in
And many impressionable youth may have thought powers like Magneto or Iron Man would be desirable, so maybe that backfired for a couple people.
I was hoping for a magnetic personality, very disappointed...
As life long Ohioan, that hearing was a sad day in our legislative history.
You know what? At this point I don’t even think these people’s issues are vaccines themselves. They just want a social scapegoat to blame their social, political and economical issues on. Before it used to be the Jews, then the Muslims and now the vaccine. Vaccines are an excuse, even for many antivaxxers. It’s simply a weapon to give meaning to some people’s lives and
some conservative political appointees something to yap about as it fits their anti-establishment and anti-government philosophy of life. I think our focus should be on the vaccine hesitant. Those neutral everyday people/patients who don’t bother to think twice when they hear such blatant and fear based messaging from influencers or even MD and scientifically trained professionals. They simply focus on the fear and risk they hear. It’s thus the job of health care professionals to establish this trust with their patients and take the time to explain things to them - at least the ones who are open to discussion! Thank you Dr. Offit.
Dr Offit, why present ridiculous examples? Everyone would be better served if you joined forces with those the vaccines skeptics side agree are the best representing the opposing views and had public discussions to get to the bottom of key issues facing the vaccine efforts. Continuing a smear campaign (anti-vaxx) is losing support for you. From say Jan 2020 to now, just for myself I’ve done a complete 180 on what you have to say on things. I’m just being honest with you, these tactics are only causing you to lose support and credibility. It’s time for you to take a new approach to gaining back support. Or do you continue to refuse an different approach such as what I describe above because subjected to that format the whole vaccine scheme falls apart? The vaccine side seems to acknowledge all products come with a risk, but for whatever reason they also seem to act in a manner that the public can’t know about these risks at any cost.
Antivax activists always lie
Good one.
….You've done a 180?
Presumably before you were provax, and are now antivax. Hopefully not for all vaccines, that would be both sad and ridiculous.
I can see how people can be persuaded that the covid vaccines are harmful, and how put off they were by “mandates” (though nobody was ever forced to get vaccinated, there was always the option to just say “no thanks”), but let’s put aside all the ideology and toxicity that politics has helped create, and just look at the plain facts of “Have these vaccines caused more benefit than harm?”
Of that there can be no doubt that the proven benefits greatly exceeds the proven harms.
The correct position to take would be to remain cautiously provaccine in your case at this point in time, so no “180” is necessary, maybe a “30” or so?
Yes was on board at the start. The covid experience was so bad, there are so many examples of where pharma / regulators purposely misled the population. Right at the start, the extensive denial of the involvement with the wuhan lab as an example. Once you see the industry is this corrupt, they have lost credibility.
I feel they have fallen from such a high pedestal that they can no longer simply dismiss their critics, that tactic is finished. To gain back respect and trust will require sitting down for open transparent discussions with those that have grievances with the actions and positions they have taken throughout this public health disaster - they were the leaders they must accept responsibility for the failures, continuing to point the finger and blame critics for their shortcomings is further eroding their credibility.
At this point refusing to engage is simply furthering the mistrust. I said before, if society is truly at risk from declining interest in vaccines then public health have a responsibility to address these issues head on. Quite frankly the opposing voices have continued to be vindicated throughout the last 4 years, their track record calling where things were going has been much better. There are so many major points public health had it totally wrong. It’s time they come to the table.
Do you really know what the involvement of the Wuhan lab was? There has been a lot of innuendo but little of substance written about it in the popular press. Like Offit, I too have been blogging on all this (I am a retired med school professor and a viral immunologist). I wrote about what the Wuhan lab did here if you are are interested: https://stevensclark.typepad.com/coronavirus_news_and_view/2023/08/part-2-gain-of-function-research-at-the-wuhan-labwhat-exactly-was-the-wuhan-lab-doing-with-coronavir.html
Steve, the “popular” press is owned by the same institutional investors that own Pfizer, Moderna, etc. It was a different world in the 1970’s when Mike Wallace on CBS’s 60 Minutes exposed the pharma fraud with the 1976 swine flu. You won’t see that sort of programming from the legacy media any longer.
And by comparison the level of fraud in 1976 was nothing compared to this time around. What was it something like 50 correlates deaths with 40 million shots and the whole program was paused then cancelled. Even Pfizer identified over a 1000 deaths they were aware of in their 90 day reporting and the regulators said no there is zero signal of problems.
The industry is a fraud, and full of people that will not stand up to say something is wrong. Just look at the emails between Collins and Fauci Jan-Feb 2020, these guys know they were up to no good.
You’re opening this up to everything relating to Covid, not just the vaccine science or Covid science, but to public health, politics and ideology.
For each science “fact” that has proved contentious or controversial, there are countless “facts” that are uncontested. The problem is you don’t hear about them, but each one that is wrong is trumpeted from the rooftops and widely spread all over social and MS media as “proof” all the science was wrong.
This is clearly a biased way of looking at things.
Mike I grew up in a household with a dentist and RN for parents. At that time medical people were among the most respected and trusted people within the communities they served - whether it was warranted is a further discussion.
They both graduated into their professions in the early 50’s. It was a much different environment back then, most doctors worked for themselves, they were autonomous to express their medical opinions, they had to answer for their positions and actions, they were not subservient to corporations, etc. There was limited advertising, you hung out your shingle and listed in the white pages, it was even considered in bad taste to advertise in the yellow pages. The age of persuasion of what we see now would be disgusting to this old guard that are long gone. The regulators were not funded by the very companies they were supposed to be monitoring and keeping to account on behalf of society. That has all changed, the conflicts of interests are overwhelming and anyone that doesn’t recognize them is either naive or part of the system benefiting from it.
Things like the CDC refusing to share the V-Safe data collected specific for the covid shots and only did so after being drawn through legal proceedings to enforce FOIA provisions. That does not inspire confidence in a system that is charged with the responsibility to look out for the public’s best interest. And the fact that the CDC’s reports produced from the v-safe data to show effectiveness and safety only following participants mostly for 1 week following vaccination should be viewed as fraudulent.
Healthcare is totally captured by the pharmaceutical industry and the vast majority of the regulators and practitioners are complicit in going along with the interests of the pharma companies. Under this environment the percentage of the population on daily drug prescriptions and taking an ever increasing number of vaccines tracks right along with ever increasing rates of chronic diseases in adults and children. We are on an insane path, we keep getting sicker yet we keep taking more of what’s not working.
It’s time people take a big step back and reevaluate, but that’s going to be very tough, because pharma will go down with the ship fighting such a direction. What’s in our best interest does not align with what is in pharma’s interest. But even in such a lopsided struggle where pharma has essentially unlimited resources and has captured regulators, practitioners, politicians, media, etc a small group is getting traction bringing light to these issues - mind you it’s always easier when you are in the side of reality.
So this is why I say public health must face their skeptics in a public forum.
I hear you....2 points though:
1. What happens in the US is vastly different to what happens elsewhere. In the UK for example, with its socialised medicine model, we don't see the conflicts of financial interest that you refer to. Yet the scientific facts around covid know no geographical boundaries, and funnily enough they seem to be the same in other countries.
2. Regarding V-safe, the data was "analysed" and published by a conflicted [antivaccine] source [ICAN] in a way to make vaccines appear to be very harmful, but this was a snake and mirrors excercise in its entirety.
For example, it was implied that a report indicated that the vaccine was the CAUSE of the problem, but this was not so and the V-safe respondents logged all medical problems they had experienced over the course of a year following their first vaccine shot. Events reported could be entirely coincidental, such as a broken arm or arthritis starting 7 months after getting the vaccine. There was horror expressed at how 7.7% of those reporting any events following vaccination had to seek medical advice...but what they don't say is that over the course of the year this amounts to just 0.08 visits per person on average per year...right?
Yet what they also don't tell you is that the average American seeks some form of medical advice 4 times per year on average. So getting vaccinated appears to hugely reduce illness and the need for seeking medical advice...correct?
Thanks for your thoughtful reply, I believe in the right settling we could have a constructive, interesting visit. I wanted to reply promptly but have to run currently, your comments have me thinking some further thoughts I’d like to share. This texting format can be dangerous in that thoughts can be interpreted not as intended - particularly on the matter of offending people. Keep in mind 4 years ago I would have been right in line with you, and I’m not alone in that department.
Hi Mike, I feel the American / Fauci response to key points set the tone that the world followed: lock down protocols, testing, natural origins, inappropriate and lack of early treatment, natural immunity not being a thing, etc. If there was ever a time that cancelling the RCT should not have been allowed this was it, forever the throw back will be correlation doesn’t confirm causation - this is one of Fauci’s oldest manipulations / fraud.
Socialized medicine is just as likely to interfere in the patient / doctor relationship as the current American system. In both models the doctor is not working for the patient. In the American one the doctor answers to the corporations and insurance companies. In the socialist model the doctor answers to the state. We saw in covid doctors weren’t free to develop and deploy treatments as arrived at between themselves and their patient. As in all relationships the one that pays calls the shots - just ask a stay at home mom that doesn’t leave a drunk that beats her. A doctor only works for you when you reach into your pocket and pay them.
Regarding ICAN, they are a thorn in the side of anyone advocating for vaccines. I think in a world free of discrimination for personal health choices (ie a world without vaccine mandates) something like ICAN may not exist. All they are saying is that vaccines should be subject to true informed consent and freedom to decided. I don’t believe ICAN has ever done anything to deny people from being able to decide to vaccinate, they just don’t want to be forced to take them. The whole social contract argument falls apart when the vaccinated are catching and spreading disease. And it’s not just the covid shots that do not sterilize disease, it’s the same for most of them. The vaccine side would have everyone believe a world without MMR would lead to mortality rates that existed in the 1800’s. that’s just misleading the CDC’s records show morality rates / 1000 declined drastically before the era of vaccinations.
And why the reluctance to do vaxxd verse unvaxxed comparisons, the CDC have the data. The odd occasion they have happened pharma goes into damage control. The DTP African study by Abby and Benn where they were surprised by the results where protection against the specific disease vaccinated for was positive but all cause mortality among the vaccinated was a 5x the unvaccinated.
Overall public health is getting worse, it’s accepted that chronic disease rates are getting worse. Many of the problems are autoimmune based. There could be multiple factors contributing to this: food, lifestyle, etc, but the one item that directly interacts in this domain by stimulating immune responses (vaccines) is forbidden from being part of the conversation. This despite pharma making moves in the early 80’s to exit the vaccine space unless the Gov’t took over liability. Then once liability was resolved has significantly increased the number of doses that are mandated to take. There is just so many problem with the vaccine space. Believe me I would not entertain the idea 5 years ago, but not because I looked into it, but because as I explained from my upbringing I was in a position in which I was primed to believe anything doctors / health professionals recommended. I didn’t get educated by organizations like children’s health defence or ICAN I wasn’t aware of them at all, I learned the hard way although I am aware of them now.
I’ve also learned that many people with a careers worth of giving vaccines are just like I was, it would never occur to them to question anything. As an example if you share the clinical trial parameters of the hep B shot they flat out won’t believe it: the lack of participants, short duration, etc. anyway, there are lots of problem as I said before and the challenging part for the vaccine advocates is that the real world situation of ever worsening health and chronic disease is a disconnect with taking ever more shots that are to be believed to make you invincible for each one that you check off. The fact that we are taking so many more shots now compared to 30+ years ago we should be so much healthier overall but we’re not.
Skepticism is a growing fact, if there is a sliver lining to covid it’s that it has got people asking a lot of questions. And the response of industry to attack the questions rather than go totally transparent to address the crisis says a lot - I believe them less all the time. The number of people not trusting public health is growing. Pharma / public health have not had to to deal with justifying themselves (they were successful simply dismissing questions in the past) and as a result have no experience in this position and the tactic they are taking are making their situation worse.
I think the main thing is I’m very happy for someone to get as many boosters as they wish, that’s none of my concern. Drop the mandates and the issue largely goes away. The whole no one is safe until everyone is safe is simply propaganda. Covid highlighted this very clearly. To those that can’t be bothered to dig deep to look, and rely on the media that is owned by pharma to tell them what to think, the idea that pharma is corrupt is just crazy.
Sorry for the long response, hopefully I didn’t lose your interest, I understand if I did. Over a beer it would be much better I’m sure.
Amazing how cheap parlor tricks at parties can be used for "proof" of magnetism.
This is a terrible, weak straw man argument that is unworthy of the author.
https://www.scribbr.co.uk/fallacy/straw-man-argument/
Is there any evidence that a concern about “magnetism” played any significant role in vaccine hesitancy in the USA? Does it explain why millions of Americans got the first mRNA dose but not the second? To make any progress on this problem, we have to address the real issues: the covid authoritarianism that destroyed trust in the public health apparatus, failure to address legitimate safety concerns, the illegal OSHA mandate, careless approval/recommendation of boosters, and the shifting amorphous “Science” that was used to justify it all. Bogus straw man arguments like these are simply being used to justify censorship of all legitimate questioning of vaccination.
It played a role in anti-vax sentiment for at least two people and presumably more....And it puts a lot of skepticsm on her other claims about the vaccines
There was a NYT article in 2021 that featured several people who got severe covid, had not received the vax because they falsely believed that “masks” and distancing would protect them. There was lots of misinformation of all kinds. Perseverating on magnetism and chips is a road to nowhere.
Masks and distancing were better than nothing and did help. Other respiratory infectious diseases plummeted (see link below). But vaccines are still the best.
https://stevensclark.typepad.com/coronavirus_news_and_view/2022/05/what-happened-to-the-flu-and-other-respiratory-diseases.html
Focus on magnetism and chips is also a thinly veiled attempt to cast all of the unvaxxed as a subhuman class of morons It belies an arrogance and elitism that guarantees that this problem will get worse.
If you characterise those who think the vaccine makes you magnetic as a subhuman moron, that speaks to your opinion.
Lucid and terse. Sinclair Lewis character George Babbitt would have loved your article because it has “punch” and “sizzle” and “pow”. Many thanks for the exegesis of glaring stupidity regarding claims of “the magnetic side effects" of receiving mRNA vaccine products. And the testimony of this apparently licensed doctor to the Ohio solons was presumably under oath.
Thanks again Paul. Tenpenny is clearly bonkers!
Ignore the russian disinformation scam that is sophocles dr offitt. Thanks for calling out the B S. WIth truth!
I am not Russian! Nor am I spreading disinformation
Separate Signal from noise . . .
This is a silly case, I agree. It would be good if you complement it with a serious case - Brianne Dressen for example. Lots to unpack there.
sad